Panzer's shotgun still defines PvP meta

Panzer is a lot more reasonable after the nerf but I was surprised to see that the Devs didn’t touch her shotgun. Unfortunately that means Panzer now just erases one hero at the start of the round instead of 2.

The entire point of role warfare was to slow the game down so heroes had time to use skills, and players had time to use strategy, instead of just nuking the entire enemy team in 15 seconds without a single skill going off (except breach lol). Unfortunately this slower gameplay only reinforces the utility of being able to burst down an enemy hero ASAP and then let the raw momentum of 5v4 overwhelm your opponent. Since Panzer is the only hero that can put out 300k+ damage without reloading that (once again) makes her the hero that will continue to decide who wins or loses every game that she is in.

It’s not about squishy energy heroes or any of that, I actually prefer just dumping the shotgun into an energy tank now (they can’t hide behind cover or roll spam) because even a 10* Gammond will melt to a 7* Panzer.

I don’t want Panzer to be useless, I’ve put virtually every mech frag I’ve ever earned into her, but as long as her shotgun can kill any energy hero (or mech squishy) in seconds - she will continue to be a blight on PVP.


We’re all noticing the same thing they partially listens
hero with 20 shotgun shells she demolishes cover
Is there a hero with more than 6 to 8 shotgun shells before they have to reload
So start blasting wait 2 to 3 seconds Breach and clear

Agreed, she’s still ruining PvP.

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I have a lot misses using shotgun, are you sure it wasn’t nerfed?
Don’t be noobs crying after the nerf, Panzer now become a useless hero and I won’t use her after 15x events.

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Panzer was extremely nerfed. Thank goodness she is somewhat useful still; But it is sad she is not nearly as fun to play anymore.

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In general pvp isn’t as fun anymore… takes waaaay too long. Zzzzzz

They definitely messed with her shotgun. The spread is larger and you can’t full auto reliably with it anymore and land consistent hits at least to back line heroes. She’s not really ruined but needed pretty hard.

I just hit the “auto” button in PvP and turn my head. I can still get my wins but I see the same heroes over and over again. That’s boring.

I never used full auto anyway so I guess I didn’t notice, tapping still gets me 100% accuracy.

Her modifiers were adjusted so she has more defense and less offense but it was a small adjustment, damage is still incredible.

My panzer has died once in the last 250 games now (since the update), it just gets old because she’s still the easiest and fastest way to win because any time you face an energy hero that match is basically a 5v4.

I think -4 ammo in her magazine might be enough.

Let loose the secret I didn’t want to say anything but he’s right
If you take time using her you might notice a few more things that make her more powerful than before
Lol 4real

She is definitely a top tier hero in PVP still, even with the nerfs.

The nerf to both her breach skills just slowed her down a little, but like you said now she can only instantly kill 1 hero in the first 10 seconds of a match instead of 2. I would have liked to of seen her shotgun nerfed to 16 shots, or you only start with 10/20 loaded, but all well.

At least she didn’t get over nerfed so she is useless now.

Her shotgun alone it’s just overwhelming those 20 shots demolish cover you’re right maybe cut it down to 10

Her damage is still great, at Platinum she still melts through your Heroes. Not just energy, but Mech also. And now you can´t even kill her. She just stands there, takes the damage and goes for your covers. I went on her with a 9* Platinum Maven and she just laughed off the damage, while staggering me by destroyng my covers with 5 shots. Thats 4 Covers within the first clip. If you go for the backline with this, your low life backline Heroes will go down in seconds. She might not be instant kill anymore, But she is as strong as ever, just in a different way.


Only midliner, to deal so much damage to cover, having so much armor and health, 1 clip reload and a shotgun, I’m happy her bronze isn’t an instant kill anymore, but her shotgun is still sick.

With this said, I think 90% of the midliners need a rework, they can’t deal any damage, or die before being useful, this new update really shows what hero’s just don’t cut it, panzer still feels to strong, but that’s probably also because others lack the damage

I tried to kill evenl strong Panzers (Platinum wiith 7+ stars) with my fully skilled 9* Platinum Maven. She should kill a Mech with ease. Even after two clips, she is only down to 1/3 of her health, while killing one or two of my heroes on her own.

They have to decide wich role she sould have. Defense or offense. You can´t make her 75% tank and 75% damage dealer, at least that is what it feels like now.


You know what this game needs… it needs video recording and video replay.

Too many opinions are being put forward here anecdotally (and I suspect, from people who could just do not like Panzer/Nightingale Skin/etc).

There are hardly any balanced opinions here. Sometimes I hope the developers don’t take the feedback on these forums too seriously!

If we have video recording and video replay it would greatly help developers zoom in on specific issues - what exactly is causing player X’s Maven not to succeed against Panzer (by the way, many Mavens including mine have succeeded against other Panzers). Is Panzer’s health the thing that made Maven fail? Is it Maven’s lack of health that caused her to fail? Or was it team loadout and player skill? Each of these questions will be answered by objective evidence and maybe it isn’t Panzer’s fault, maybe the fix is that Maven’s health needs a buff.

I’m just so sick of people complaining about Panzer, Nightingale skin, etc.

And just watch out for August… people will be complaining about Ifrit’s Showtime, just because hey, they lost a great many games not being able to adapt to it.

Every good skill created by the developers is there for a reason - it’s good. It’s even really good. That’s why they made it right. But people aren’t happy.

Give us video evidence of actual live play so that people can properly critique why this happened and why that happened. It’s not always Panzer’s fault. It is not always that “Mandrake/Night/Flatline causes a circle of ultimate and unkillable healing”. All this anecdotal BS can then finally go away.


There aren’t videos, but people posted a TON of match results when Panzer was first released. There we saw her doing 30k DPS. For most heroes that have around 300k health, she would be able to kill them in 10 seconds or less… by herself.

Really though, that isn’t very telling considering she was instantly doing 200k+ with Breach and Clear to energy heroes, then another several thousand per shot with her 20 clip shotgun. This was unavoidable damage. Instantly losing 1-2 heroes was not only unfair, it was not fun. She needed to be nerfed, and needed it hard. When you have as many complaining about one character as there were about Panzer, you know there is a problem.

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I don’t understand why you seem to be objecting to the main point in my post about video evidence. In this regard, video evidence would in fact AUGMENT the point that Panzer was OP, wouldn’t it?? Video evidence would in fact lead to the correct conclusion being drawn faster, wouldn’t it?

Victory and Defeat screenshots tell so little. If you felt like making a point to lose to a Drake/Night(Skin)/Flatline combo you’d simply kill yourself and take those Defeat screenshots time after time, and guess what, after some time people will begin to think that combo is invincible. Nerf comes and … end of story.

Video replays are important for decoding problems comprehensively and accurately, there is no decent substitute.

I have no doubt HHG can and have logged data about hero winrates and they have hero data collection mechanisms available to them on the back end (unless HHG is so low-tech that they do not even do so, which I don’t believe at this point).

But such data is good for macro-level decision making. Fine tuning the exact steps to remedy balance issues need to be dealt with with precision - the correct surgery, if you like, to cure the correctly identified problem.

VIdeo replays are of course, also good for learning and play improvement, and if you get a particularly great win, for bragging rights as well - but that’s a different issue. Here we are talking about being able to verify the anecdotal complaints experienced to see whether their concerns are valid and secondly, the best way to address them. In an objective and balanced way without consideration of a player’s sore feeling(s) due to a loss to that hero (again).

Agreed, but that’s why I said that I think the biggest problem is the health of other midliners

Also the way she shoots cover down, it’s faster then any tank, and she’s doing it at the same rate as Baron.

You’ll see her damage is lower then the other midliners, but her health is so much higher, making it harder to kill her then any other midliner with a good healer team.

That’s why I think midliners and probably snipers to need a rework, to balance the health/damage more out.

I still have my moments, I like this update at the same time I struggle with it.

This just shook up how you need to play PvP, I can use teams I could never use before and I like that, the biggest problem still is min maxing to break the competition, if you do this with a hero like panzer then it’s just easy wins, and I also think that is the reason why people have so much trouble with panzer

Thanks Kraterios, and I think you have pinpointed the issue. It’s min-maxing. It is not necessarily Panzer’s clip is too big, her damage is too much, etc. It’s the guys cheating the system to get an overpowered matchup, but it doesn’t mean that the hero is overpowered.


So, don’t let the tail wag the dog. HHG has to prescribe the correct medicine for the correct disease. Fix min-maxing, matchmaking and valuation of skills once and for all. Let people with similar game-world strengths match each other.